These are getting used[]

People looking for info are finding these county boxes and putting their queries in. Excellent concept, Phlox, and pretty durn good execution! I've used some "br" tags to shorten some of the lines (in this one and the UK one) so that people suffer little or no horizontal scrolling need. My only remaining quibble is that the "people" line sends readers to categories, where we really don't want visitors filling the screen with paragraphs of material so that subcategories and articles are pushed down out of sight. Solutions may be in the next paragraph. Robin Patterson 15:46, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Targets of the boxes[]

Categories (the "People" line)[]

This is the most likely one for enquirers to choose (apart from "Queries" at the bottom) because it says it is about people. Most of the target categories haven't been created yet; so when someone clicks and starts one of them and adds a message or fact, the category:

  • is a bit of an orphan, because it has no subcategories, articles, or media and no parent category (and probably no outward links)
  • has material that is preferably located on an article page, not on a category page.

I would like to have one of our flagged bots run over the nearly 15,000 U.S. boxes and do the following:

  1. IF category has no parent category,
    1. THEN give it two. For each of the four categories for any county/borough/parish, the categories will be the same except for one word (Born/Died/Married/Resided) - recent page Category:Resided in Chautauqua County, New York has examples.
    2. THEN add something right at the top of the category page. This will start with the county genealogy template (with the piped parameter as noted in the instructions), followed by Template:AlsoWP (subject to our checking whether WP really has equivalents for all categories) and finally Template:Catmore+ (which refers to the proposed "main" article page and encourages readers to create that and write on it instead of on the category page). (The really clued-up readers may realise that we would prefer them to create and categorise a separate page for each individual mentioned, but that's too much to ask casual enquirers to handle.)
  2. BUT IF (as will rarely be the case) it has at least one category, it has probably been created by someone who knows a bit about what it should have, and may already have Template:Catmore or a similar link to an article or just a list of obvious articles that the casual enquirer should be able to light on;
    1. THEN give it only:
      1. the categories determined as above (deleting exact duplicates if any)
      2. the county genealogy template (unless it already has it)
      3. a new temporary Category:county-related categories for checking for manual checking by those of us who feel like patrolling for imperfections and will be led to these from Category:Wikia maintenance).

I've done several in the last few days and will happily join a discussion of detail on the bot talk page or similar page.

Robin Patterson 15:46, 5 July 2008 (UTC) - with some amendments later Robin Patterson 14:22, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Subpages (the other three lines)[]

These are easier to handle. Anybody can write anything on them, basically, without upsetting the wiki's structure and functionality. Enquiries would be better on "talk" pages or on the "Queries" subpage, but any content on those 130,000 pages will be welcome until they start filling.

But each of them wants categories too, just as the new target categories mentioned above do. Because each is a subpage, it has a prominent link to its county page (and the downward link in the box where we started), which a conservative user may think is enough linkage, but it would be more obvious and more easily found if it were specifically in its county's category - one fewer step for searchers browsing down the category tree from country or state.

So I would like them pre-created and categorised in the same sort of way as I want for the categories under the previous heading.

I think we want the template added to them too (as has been done with some), but it needs care. I saw it on a census subpage and thought that it could cause problems because its title was the subpage title, which just doesn't relate to some of those boxes - but I found later that that must have been a carelessly-created exception. The instructions for use of the template ask the editor to ensure that the BASEPAGENAME is used. BASEPAGENAME is the page name stripped of all subpage references, e.g. "Greene County, Ohio" rather than "Greene County, Ohio/census". So I'll revise the instructions to clarify further.

As above, I'll very happily join in a discussion with anybody willing to do the bot work or at least to tell me how difficult it might be. Maybe I should make a direct approach to bot users.

Robin Patterson 15:46, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

Non-existent parent categories[]

Most of the parent categories referenced by the above process do not, apparently, exist yet. See Category:Born in Custer County, Oklahoma for a recent example. Not even the county category (which should have the county page as its "star" component). That can be dealt with by later bot runs (possibly copying from Wikipedia) and should be discussed on more relevant pages such as Forum:Model state pages. "Tomorrow" or the next day! Robin Patterson 15:46, 5 July 2008 (UTC)

This is apparently superseded![]

This template was used by Phlox for Greene County, Ohio subpages etc (and a couple of other pages, including a New York subpage, have it) but he used the "county2" one for the bot runs that created all the others. I see very little difference, but there may be a subtle difference and it would be sensible to have all matching; so we could change the twenty pages that use this template. Robin Patterson 06:35, 7 July 2008 (UTC)

The now remaining sixteen are all subpages of Greene County, Ohio. There are definite differences between county1 and county2 because of some of the moving and adding and converting that I and others have done since county2 was created. Greene County, Ohio is one we show off as one of our best pages, so it needs some care in updating. Nothing happening there tonight. Robin Patterson 09:19, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

This discussion has also been superseded in part; see Forum:County-based categories, Forum:County subpages - categorising, and Template:Born in UK. Robin Patterson 09:19, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

On that last point, one might also now mention {{Bdm}}. -- Robin Patterson (Talk) 06:13, October 22, 2015 (UTC)


Some kind anon unwittingly helped us see a defect in these templates when he or she created a subpage from a Greene County link. See [[1]]. THURSTAN worked out that we need ROOTPAGENAME rather than BASEPAGENAME so as to cover all or most possible page creations. -- Robin Patterson (Talk) 06:13, October 22, 2015 (UTC)